Chassis Materials: Arrma's false advertising

[SrC]

This conversation is heading in a good direction and questions should be asked about the quality of the high prices we are paying for this stuff.

But lets keep it real, guys seem to want to mimic those clowns on YouTube—who get free poop from all these companies and don’t spent a dime on their toys, just chasing “like” and “subscribe”— and launch their toys off of whatever cliff is by their home.

Then when it breaks they want to cry that it’s cheap. Reality check—launching your toy 100+ feet in the air doesn’t make you a professional anything. Just a mimic and cry baby on this forum who ends up having buyers regret because you spent rent or mortgage money just to get some likes on YouTube. Some of you take attention away from valid issues. THERE ISNT A COMPANY OUT THERE WHO WARRANTIES ANY VEHICLE FROM EXTREME ABUSE!

Go join a real competition and put your driving and mechanic skills to the test.

Well said.
I have said this several times here on AF. With many who dislike this sad truth, flaming me. And feel it is their money and their rig to do what they want.
That is ok, until you end up here crying. Expecting us to sing Kumbaya and cry along with you. NOT.

 

[LibertyMKiii]

I am thrilled that I can buy a new chassis from a breaker like Jennys for $25 bucks + shipping.
End of story for me...

For my rig that I beat the snot out of I have an M2C chassis.... I don't expect a whole lot from the factory chassis.

 

[SuperFanBoy]

Okay okay
Fact: my chassis didn’t bend
Fact: several of my friends chassis have bent (not a fact to you because you weren’t there, of course)
Fact: Arrma is so far my favorite brand
Fact: I have tekno, traxxas, arrma, redcat, tlr and they all have flaws—because like I said, if they made perfect cars, they wouldn’t make money on after market parts.
Fact: I earn my money, I’m a consumer just like you, better business bureau does exist for a reason, no one knows if the car is as promised until you put it on the ground—and at that point it can’t be returned—BECAUSE THEY don't BELIEVE OR TRUST US WHEN WE SAY SOMETHING IS NOT RIGHT, so tell me again why we should religiously trust them?

Come on man, don’t kick me off the forum for this.

So just tell us the process instead of slapping us around. It’s just a good discussion. I’ve learn a lot from everyone here and the people I’ve come across and from some of those idiots on YouTube like Kevin Talbot who gets free poop and doesn’t have to worry about destroying cars.

I'm new here, but not new to the hobby. My first basher was a Fazon back in '18 then followed up with a Raider XL for the kid and a Outcast V3. I've had most popular brands, and keep an open mind about all of this, including brands, marketing, materials, pricing ect.

From my experience in the fab shop and 10 years in the Oil & Gas industry in handling both the materials appear to look, and act as they should. My Outcast V3 is still running and has it's original chassis. Because back then you knew if you took it to the skate park it would break.

Really the chassis' are what people are questioning, as that's what people are saying is prematurely failing. Compare a V1-V4 chassis ( no strengthening ridges in the rear) to an EXB and its obvious the EXB is superior. No facts, just my opinion and general experience. ( never bent ANY chassis keep in mind ) between these the only difference is the material and how it's prepared. There is a difference strength wise between stamped, laser/waterjet, machined ect. but not much if the material is not that good. Hence the cheap method. its all to stay in a price point.

So we can all say the EXB is a better chassis than the BLX version. Now, the next step is what ado you compare the EXB to??? To my knowledge nobody makes a 3mm 7075 chassis that's not milled out for lightweight/ speed runs. Just because the EXB is 7075 doesn't mean there isn't a gradient for quality. M2C is better 7075 hands down. When you get into the higher quality you get certs with it to back up claims due to the ease of ability to fake or mislead buyers, in bulk raw form- not the consumer directly.

So to compare a EXB 3mm to a M2C 4mm chassis is just not practical and raises doubt to any future claims... of anything. Not everyone can sit at the adult table lol Gotta know when to take a seat at the kids unfortunately haha.

So, now to say they just don't hold up like they used to/ should. in my opinion, there should be some flex, and it should be controlled. by using diff materials to absorb and redirect the forces exerted. We all know you can't build a unbreakable rc, the Aluminum arms are a prime example. Some materials have different rebound abilities. to flex and return to its original shape. When you thicken up the chassis and brace it all to heck impacts send all that energy to SOMETHING. When I started bashing back in '17 I don't remember people slamming full speed into small ramps with not much transition. The G forces exerted on the shocks and chassis are crazy! it doesn't matter how you land when your battery came undone from the impact of just going off the "jump" How much bracing to run, what material to use on which one, ect all depends on the person, terrain, rc ect. there is no right answer. It's all subjective. Like almost everything on here and the hobby haha. My V3 runs just as it came, plastic front/ rear braces and no T to T brace. It gets ran all the time, I'll se if I can post a video of last night lol took a rough landing and chassis is fine. broke a shock rod end though lol


Lastly I'm new to the forum and should have better used the quote feature. I'm coming from the FB "groups" and still had the Apocalypse Now mindset haha I apologize if I offended. I wasn't trying to call out anyone of say anything bad about anyone in particular. Sorry if I harsh or abrasive, The Roughneck tends to come out in me from time to time hehe I wasn't saying to leave the group or anything, more so asking why stay with a brand you think is lying to you. I have a hard time with discussion threads like this as I have a mission complete mindset often. I saw it as a fix it or accept it thing. That's my bad. In my defense though I say I was baited

 

[N.Mango]

I'm new here, but not new to the hobby. My first basher was a Fazon back in '18 then followed up with a Raider XL for the kid and a Outcast V3. I've had most popular brands, and keep an open mind about all of this, including brands, marketing, materials, pricing ect.

From my experience in the fab shop and 10 years in the Oil & Gas industry in handling both the materials appear to look, and act as they should. My Outcast V3 is still running and has it's original chassis. Because back then you knew if you took it to the skate park it would break.

Really the chassis' are what people are questioning, as that's what people are saying is prematurely failing. Compare a V1-V4 chassis ( no strengthening ridges in the rear) to an EXB and its obvious the EXB is superior. No facts, just my opinion and general experience. ( never bent ANY chassis keep in mind ) between these the only difference is the material and how it's prepared. There is a difference strength wise between stamped, laser/waterjet, machined ect. but not much if the material is not that good. Hence the cheap method. its all to stay in a price point.

So we can all say the EXB is a better chassis than the BLX version. Now, the next step is what ado you compare the EXB to??? To my knowledge nobody makes a 3mm 7075 chassis that's not milled out for lightweight/ speed runs. Just because the EXB is 7075 doesn't mean there isn't a gradient for quality. M2C is better 7075 hands down. When you get into the higher quality you get certs with it to back up claims due to the ease of ability to fake or mislead buyers, in bulk raw form- not the consumer directly.

So to compare a EXB 3mm to a M2C 4mm chassis is just not practical and raises doubt to any future claims... of anything. Not everyone can sit at the adult table lol Gotta know when to take a seat at the kids unfortunately haha.

So, now to say they just don't hold up like they used to/ should. in my opinion, there should be some flex, and it should be controlled. by using diff materials to absorb and redirect the forces exerted. We all know you can't build a unbreakable rc, the Aluminum arms are a prime example. Some materials have different rebound abilities. to flex and return to its original shape. When you thicken up the chassis and brace it all to heck impacts send all that energy to SOMETHING. When I started bashing back in '17 I don't remember people slamming full speed into small ramps with not much transition. The G forces exerted on the shocks and chassis are crazy! it doesn't matter how you land when your battery came undone from the impact of just going off the "jump" How much bracing to run, what material to use on which one, ect all depends on the person, terrain, rc ect. there is no right answer. It's all subjective. Like almost everything on here and the hobby haha. My V3 runs just as it came, plastic front/ rear braces and no T to T brace. It gets ran all the time, I'll se if I can post a video of last night lol took a rough landing and chassis is fine. broke a shock rod end though lol


Lastly I'm new to the forum and should have better used the quote feature. I'm coming from the FB "groups" and still had the Apocalypse Now mindset haha I apologize if I offended. I wasn't trying to call out anyone of say anything bad about anyone in particular. Sorry if I harsh or abrasive, The Roughneck tends to come out in me from time to time hehe I wasn't saying to leave the group or anything, more so asking why stay with a brand you think is lying to you. I have a hard time with discussion threads like this as I have a mission complete mindset often. I saw it as a fix it or accept it thing. That's my bad. In my defense though I say I was baited

It's all good. If everyone thought the same or had the same idea's this forum would be a boring one!

 

[SrC]

I'm new here, but not new to the hobby. My first basher was a Fazon back in '18 then followed up with a Raider XL for the kid and a Outcast V3. I've had most popular brands, and keep an open mind about all of this, including brands, marketing, materials, pricing ect.

From my experience in the fab shop and 10 years in the Oil & Gas industry in handling both the materials appear to look, and act as they should. My Outcast V3 is still running and has it's original chassis. Because back then you knew if you took it to the skate park it would break.

Really the chassis' are what people are questioning, as that's what people are saying is prematurely failing. Compare a V1-V4 chassis ( no strengthening ridges in the rear) to an EXB and its obvious the EXB is superior. No facts, just my opinion and general experience. ( never bent ANY chassis keep in mind ) between these the only difference is the material and how it's prepared. There is a difference strength wise between stamped, laser/waterjet, machined ect. but not much if the material is not that good. Hence the cheap method. its all to stay in a price point.

So we can all say the EXB is a better chassis than the BLX version. Now, the next step is what ado you compare the EXB to??? To my knowledge nobody makes a 3mm 7075 chassis that's not milled out for lightweight/ speed runs. Just because the EXB is 7075 doesn't mean there isn't a gradient for quality. M2C is better 7075 hands down. When you get into the higher quality you get certs with it to back up claims due to the ease of ability to fake or mislead buyers, in bulk raw form- not the consumer directly.

So to compare a EXB 3mm to a M2C 4mm chassis is just not practical and raises doubt to any future claims... of anything. Not everyone can sit at the adult table lol Gotta know when to take a seat at the kids unfortunately haha.

So, now to say they just don't hold up like they used to/ should. in my opinion, there should be some flex, and it should be controlled. by using diff materials to absorb and redirect the forces exerted. We all know you can't build a unbreakable rc, the Aluminum arms are a prime example. Some materials have different rebound abilities. to flex and return to its original shape. When you thicken up the chassis and brace it all to heck impacts send all that energy to SOMETHING. When I started bashing back in '17 I don't remember people slamming full speed into small ramps with not much transition. The G forces exerted on the shocks and chassis are crazy! it doesn't matter how you land when your battery came undone from the impact of just going off the "jump" How much bracing to run, what material to use on which one, ect all depends on the person, terrain, rc ect. there is no right answer. It's all subjective. Like almost everything on here and the hobby haha. My V3 runs just as it came, plastic front/ rear braces and no T to T brace. It gets ran all the time, I'll se if I can post a video of last night lol took a rough landing and chassis is fine. broke a shock rod end though lol


Lastly I'm new to the forum and should have better used the quote feature. I'm coming from the FB "groups" and still had the Apocalypse Now mindset haha I apologize if I offended. I wasn't trying to call out anyone of say anything bad about anyone in particular. Sorry if I harsh or abrasive, The Roughneck tends to come out in me from time to time hehe I wasn't saying to leave the group or anything, more so asking why stay with a brand you think is lying to you. I have a hard time with discussion threads like this as I have a mission complete mindset often. I saw it as a fix it or accept it thing. That's my bad. In my defense though I say I was baited

You appear to have a realistic look at things.
Chassis are designed to flex to a point. I have bent many LWB V4 chassis. And many have bent EXB's as well. I don't hear much about the LWB V5 chassis doing this for some reason.

 

[N.Mango]

There's tough and then there's TOUGH!

 

[Angel]

I'm new here, but not new to the hobby. My first basher was a Fazon back in '18 then followed up with a Raider XL for the kid and a Outcast V3. I've had most popular brands, and keep an open mind about all of this, including brands, marketing, materials, pricing ect.

From my experience in the fab shop and 10 years in the Oil & Gas industry in handling both the materials appear to look, and act as they should. My Outcast V3 is still running and has it's original chassis. Because back then you knew if you took it to the skate park it would break.

Really the chassis' are what people are questioning, as that's what people are saying is prematurely failing. Compare a V1-V4 chassis ( no strengthening ridges in the rear) to an EXB and its obvious the EXB is superior. No facts, just my opinion and general experience. ( never bent ANY chassis keep in mind ) between these the only difference is the material and how it's prepared. There is a difference strength wise between stamped, laser/waterjet, machined ect. but not much if the material is not that good. Hence the cheap method. its all to stay in a price point.

So we can all say the EXB is a better chassis than the BLX version. Now, the next step is what ado you compare the EXB to??? To my knowledge nobody makes a 3mm 7075 chassis that's not milled out for lightweight/ speed runs. Just because the EXB is 7075 doesn't mean there isn't a gradient for quality. M2C is better 7075 hands down. When you get into the higher quality you get certs with it to back up claims due to the ease of ability to fake or mislead buyers, in bulk raw form- not the consumer directly.

So to compare a EXB 3mm to a M2C 4mm chassis is just not practical and raises doubt to any future claims... of anything. Not everyone can sit at the adult table lol Gotta know when to take a seat at the kids unfortunately haha.

So, now to say they just don't hold up like they used to/ should. in my opinion, there should be some flex, and it should be controlled. by using diff materials to absorb and redirect the forces exerted. We all know you can't build a unbreakable rc, the Aluminum arms are a prime example. Some materials have different rebound abilities. to flex and return to its original shape. When you thicken up the chassis and brace it all to heck impacts send all that energy to SOMETHING. When I started bashing back in '17 I don't remember people slamming full speed into small ramps with not much transition. The G forces exerted on the shocks and chassis are crazy! it doesn't matter how you land when your battery came undone from the impact of just going off the "jump" How much bracing to run, what material to use on which one, ect all depends on the person, terrain, rc ect. there is no right answer. It's all subjective. Like almost everything on here and the hobby haha. My V3 runs just as it came, plastic front/ rear braces and no T to T brace. It gets ran all the time, I'll se if I can post a video of last night lol took a rough landing and chassis is fine. broke a shock rod end though lol


Lastly I'm new to the forum and should have better used the quote feature. I'm coming from the FB "groups" and still had the Apocalypse Now mindset haha I apologize if I offended. I wasn't trying to call out anyone of say anything bad about anyone in particular. Sorry if I harsh or abrasive, The Roughneck tends to come out in me from time to time hehe I wasn't saying to leave the group or anything, more so asking why stay with a brand you think is lying to you. I have a hard time with discussion threads like this as I have a mission complete mindset often. I saw it as a fix it or accept it thing. That's my bad. In my defense though I say I was baited

I like this

 

[SuperFanBoy]

To expound further on the metallurgy at question, something to keep in mind is that both Arma chassis are 3mm Aluminum. one is a better quality alloy, and not stamped. It's not that big of a jump, so you can only expect so much out of the better version. I'll post a link, it might be hard to read but its all there.

Link: https://www.thomasnet.com/articles/metals-metal-products/6061-aluminum-vs-7075-aluminum/

Here's a portion that speaks to the topic at hand

The yield strength is the measure of the maximum amount of stress that will not permanently (or just “elastically”) deform a specimen of alloy (to learn more on this topic, feel free to read about it in our article all about 7075 aluminum alloy). When comparing 6061 and 7075 aluminum’s yield strengths, it is evident that 7075 aluminum is far superior by a factor of almost 2. This is a consequence of 7075’s chemical composition, as well as the result of heat treating. However, 6061 alloy is not to be thought of as weak, as a yield strength of 276 MPa is only slightly less than some low carbon steels.

The modulus of elasticity is a measure of a material’s resistance to permanent (or “plastic”) deformation. It is useful as a means of defining the “stiffness” of a material. There is a small difference when comparing the moduli of these alloys, which suggests that these materials behave similarly when elastically deformed.

Just want to point out... if we want to Sherlock this out, there are facts and ways to go about it. If we just bitchin' and wishn' then there's deff a way for that haha happy Monday Everyone! lol

 

[SrC]

I'm no expert in metals or bending RC chassis, but I'm pretty sure a legit test would show that the material used is whats advertised.
If you truly think about the forces thats happening on the chassis while bashing it really shouldnt be surprising that it bends.
Any company has too much to lose by this degree of false advertising over something thats very easy to have tested.
This is just my opinion of course and would love this topic to be put to rest.
Arrma I'm sure know's the word about their chassis going around
that its weak and not made of what they say it is, and they should guarantee it so as to challenge us, the customer, to prove them wrong.
But until its tested this subject will be around for as long as bashers exist.

I agree this would be the only true way to test it. For the very least amount of $1000 or so one could pretty much ruin a company's reputation.
I personally don't think Arrma would take that risk. But if I'm wrong, the first to do so could get paid some pretty nice hush money.
STOP IT! BLACKMAILING IS ILLEGAL!!!

I feel Made in Cn stuff can be labeled whatever they choose and get away with it. There is no regulating the QC and materials that one ends up purchasing in this hobby. Alloys come in many grades. And it's all too easy to cut corners to keep a price point down. HH has little control IMHO opinion. They just need production models to keep up pace at their current price point. They have no intentions of rocking the "Outsourced Boat". If they did, QC on the most basic assy. complaints/issues would have improved by now. Some issues that are for years now, very old and continue.
My spin.

The real question is about the value, more than the material they are using (or not using, in this case). We'll never know what material Arrma is using.

At full MSRP, the EXB chassis is 55% more expensive than stock RTR and the M2C chassis is 83% more expensive than stock RTR.

I never tried an EXB, but from the numerous reports we can find here and elsewhere online, it seems you only get marginal gain (if any) for that 55% added cost with the EXB, but the added value you get with the M2C seems well worth the 83% added cost compared to the stock RTR.

Basically, I think it's probably better not to bother with the EXB chassis.

+1

I think I figured It out they take the old recycled aluminum cans and melt them into a chassis

Absolutely true. Cn is an alloy/steel monger. It is their bread and butter. They struggle to get raw metal material globally. Never having enough.
If they can squeeze 2 cents out of an aluminum can, an old steel frame bicycle and low carbon scrap steel, mix it all together, they will, in a heart beat.
It is Cn's claim to fame. And no one else will challenge them on this.

 

[🇺🇸 DΞזΞפּ 🇺🇸]

Lastly I'm new to the forum and should have better used the quote feature. I'm coming from the FB "groups" and still had the Apocalypse Now mindset haha

Haha yeah It's brutal out there, I got hammered on there yesterday for nothing really

 

[SrC]

Lastly I'm new to the forum and should have better used the quote feature. I'm coming from the FB "groups" and still had the Apocalypse Now mindset haha I apologize if I offended. I wasn't trying to call out anyone of say anything bad about anyone in particular. Sorry if I harsh or abrasive, The Roughneck tends to come out in me from time to time hehe I wasn't saying to leave the group or anything, more so asking why stay with a brand you think is lying to you. I have a hard time with discussion threads like this as I have a mission complete mindset often. I saw it as a fix it or accept it thing. That's my bad. In my defense though I say I was baited

Yeah AF is among the kinder, gentler RC gatherings these days. Believe it or not. A collective group of years of seasoned RC knowledge.
You opinion does matter. Experience and all.
Lest you not forget.

 

[SrC]

The TLR Typhon seems to be made from decent material, I don’t know it might be just the coating, but it looks high quality

The TLRT chassis is SWB. It is listed as an Arrma upgrade part for the Notorious and V5 Typhon.
SWB chassis' bend much less. (being shorter is more tolerant to bending)
It's anyones guess if the TLRT chassis is weaker or stronger than the EXB SWB variant.
I'm Disappointed that the TLRT chassis has not been released yet by Arrma. Neither is its pricing published yet. Or any of the TLRT specific parts.
Looks to be the better chassis. Clearly a CNC'ed chassis. The EXB appears to be stamped. Whatever it is claimed to be made of. IDK.

https://www.arrma-rc.com/part/ARA320646

 

[SuperFanBoy]

The TLRT chassis is SWB. It is listed as an Arrma upgrade part for the Notorious and V5 Typhon.
SWB chassis' bend much less. (being shorter is more tolerant to bending)
It's anyone's guess if the TLRT chassis is weaker or stronger than the EXB SWB variant.
I'm Disappointed that the TLRT chassis has not been released yet by Arrma. Neither is its pricing published yet. Or any of the TLRT specific parts.
Looks to be the better chassis. Clearly a CNC'ed chassis. The EXB appears to be stamped. Whatever it is made of. IDK.

https://www.arrma-rc.com/part/ARA320646

The Typhon TLR chassis is available from Jenny's, its like 70 bucks. I understand that's not the same as a factory shipped officially sold part. But it's at least half the price. I think I read somewhere it has a treatment process that helps increase strength. But the sections that are CNC milled out to reduce the weight will not help strength, actually it hurts strength. M2C makes the same chassis, its called the speed version, and explicitly says for speed runs and light bashing only. I just picked up my first Typhon over the weekend actually, and was debating building a flyweight outcast/Noto with that chassis. For bashing I would take the EXB over the TLR version for a basher though.

 

[SuperFanBoy]

You appear to have a realistic look at things.
Chassis are designed to flex to a point. I have bent many LWB V4 chassis. And many have bent EXB's as well. I don't hear much about the LWB V5 chassis doing this for some reason.

the V5 LWB has the two ridges in the rear where it gets narrow. That would be my guess, plus maybe more people run the Kraton EXB so just not many running the V5 version? After the holiday sales it seems like everyone has like 3-4 laying around haha I know 2 of mine are guilty of that haha....

 

[SrC]

+1

 

[KevinC]

For fellow Canadians out there.
https://eliminator-rc.com/ sells M2C bits and bobs. Priced a Mojave EXB chassis at my LHS……$168 CDN.
Price for the M2C Mojave chassis at Eliminator was $178 CDN.

I’ll spend another 10 bucks for a superior product.

 

[SuperFanBoy]

The Typhon TLR chassis is available from Jenny's, its like 70 bucks. I understand that's not the same as a factory shipped officially sold part. But it's at least half the price. I think I read somewhere it has a treatment process that helps increase strength. But the sections that are CNC milled out to reduce the weight will not help strength, actually it hurts strength. M2C makes the same chassis, its called the speed version, and explicitly says for speed runs and light bashing only. I just picked up my first Typhon over the weekend actually, and was debating building a flyweight outcast/Noto with that chassis. For bashing I would take the EXB over the TLR version for a basher though.

She'll deff see light bashing. I had these badlands laying on the bench so I had to toss em on l Deff too tall and narrow. Would prob be ok with the wider Mojave arms though.

 

[21STalion]

She'll deff see light bashing. I had these badlands laying on the bench so I had to toss em on l Deff too tall and narrow. Would prob be ok with the wider Mojave arms though.

View attachment 203456

View attachment 203467

That's mean AF
I like it

 

[SuperFanBoy]

That's mean AF
I like it

Thanks Just a goof, not sure if it would drive vary good but the Mojave stuff might be more managible. Usually Duberbash and them use the Kraton/ Outcast arms for their truggies or whatever their called. Still a few months out till snow's gone, and this rc was more of a strike while the iron's hot kinda deal so It'll be a while before it gets ran unfortunatly.

 

[slick2500]

The TLRT chassis is SWB. It is listed as an Arrma upgrade part for the Notorious and V5 Typhon.
SWB chassis' bend much less. (being shorter is more tolerant to bending)
It's anyones guess if the TLRT chassis is weaker or stronger than the EXB SWB variant.
I'm Disappointed that the TLRT chassis has not been released yet by Arrma. Neither is its pricing published yet. Or any of the TLRT specific parts.
Looks to be the better chassis. Clearly a CNC'ed chassis. The EXB appears to be stamped. Whatever it is claimed to be made of. IDK.

https://www.arrma-rc.com/part/ARA320646

I still have my stock Outcast chassis from 2017, I don't even think it's bent I know the droop screws had almost pushed through the ears though.